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Posted by montynonuts on 05-Jul-2011 20:42 Report
Blunder with Aust Post
Good Evening Everyone
What a day it has been today !

I had a registered parcel go missing yesterday and my phone call today to Australia Post Enquiries told me I could do nothing as the Seller is the one who has to chase up a claim with them

Even though I paid for registered post with person to person delivery to make sure I got the parcel, it was delivered to the wrong address and the people there signed for it even though it was clearly not their name and address and the courier accepted the false name as receipt of delivery

The Aust Post tracking system worked perfectly as it gave us the name of the person who signed for it 

If it wasn't for their name on the tracking they would have got away with it as I was tracking this and saw that it had been delivered to another person and if it was not for the fact my husband looked in the phone book to see if the name was a local one and seeing the people lived in the street behind us, went to get it off them,
They admitted it was there and gave it to my husband.

While AP is not to blame for the people receiving my parcel, they are to blame for delivering it to the wrong address and accepting another name and I will be taking further action on this matter

My seller was willing to send another if it went missing and I am thankful she did not have to

I wonder how many more parcels have gone missing like this.

My suggestion to everyone is even registered parcels has its up and downs and has to be followed up

Edit: Luckily they were listed in the phone book and we have lived here for nearly 35 Years

 
Replied by tvshowsondvd on 05-Jul-2011 20:53 (Ref 2302654) Report
I also had this happen when i moved to newcastle.

I had redirected my mail but didn't realise it didn't include overseas parcels.

The parcel was delivered to my old address.

Luckily my postie hear got me in touch with the big bosses at both mail centres.

They found out who had signed for it and kept sending them a slip to say they had to pick up a parcel from the mail room.

It took about 3 weeks for them to reply.

Once they did they hit them up for the parcel and i was returned.

I bet it happens more than we think.
Replied by remaynerecycled on 05-Jul-2011 21:05 (Ref 2302656) Report
So the seller was the one who dealt with Australia Post on your behalf and found your parcel? They've obviously kept you well up to date on what went on.

Last week a buyer of mine contacted me about a lost parcel and refused to let me chase it up as they preferred to do it themselves. As it was well over due and a few days later they marked it as received I'm guessing that the post office let them deal with it themselves. All they needed from me was the date on the receipt plus I gave them time posted so not sure if they used that or not.

Possibly as with a lot of things involving AP and other agencies it might depend on who you happen to get to deal with your problem as to what advice is given to you.
Replied by montynonuts on 05-Jul-2011 21:11 (Ref 2302657) Report
Hello remaynerecycled

As I said before the tracking told us who had signed for it which my husband then found in the phone book and went and ask them for our parcel
At this stage the seller had no idea that we had tracked the parcel down
So if we did not get our parcel back the seller would have had to do it

I did email the seller afterwards and told her what happened
She thanked me and said that it would of been her responsibilty to find it
Kind Regards
Monty
Replied by fashion-lover40 on 05-Jul-2011 21:48 (Ref 2302658) Report
unfortunately as a seller myself Ive had a parcel ive sent via registered post missing - I dont  understand how this could happen since registered post is supposed to be a tracked system.  The online tracking system showed no results so already australia post was at fault for not scanning the parcel and unfortunately the parcel got lost in the system - either the buyer was not honest and recieved the item without telling me knowing well and truly there was no info on the online tracking system or someone at australia post ended up taking the parcel?? who knows.. it took me over a month to get a refund for this but i ultimately lost out because I had no choice but to give my buyer a full refund. I'm starting to think that maybe sending items via express post is more reliable than registered post. 
Replied by missdaisy on 05-Jul-2011 23:34 (Ref 2302665) Report
Well, with all the mail that has gone missing here this year, I have gotten to the point where I don't feel confident of getting ANYTHING.  And now you tell me even Reg. Post is not reliable.  What's a person to do?  I do a lot of mail order shopping. 
Replied by magnolia134 on 06-Jul-2011 00:27 (Ref 2302667) Report
>>I'm starting to think that maybe sending items via express post is more reliable than registered post. <<

Express Post only works if both buyer and seller are within prescribed postcode zones (usually big cities only). A parcel may get to other postcodes a little faster than ordinary mail, but there is still no guarantee it is any safer than any other form of postage.
Replied by issabella10 on 06-Jul-2011 07:34 (Ref 2302677) Report
Makes you wonder how a courier can get the wrong street ? So AP uses a courier to deliver items like this ? Shows you how much I know but we don't have delivery here so everything goes to the PO anyway   .

Unless the people that signed for it were genuinely unaware the parcel wasn't for them - mail theft is serious so they were pretty game.

Glad you got that sorted monty and lucky that the people signed their name legible .
Replied by marian-48 on 06-Jul-2011 07:48 (Ref 2302683) Report
Good Morning Monty, yes thats very slack of the delivery driver AND the receiver of the parcel.
It should be thoroughly investigated by AP, and at the very minimum the postage & registered post fee should be refunded to you.
How bad for the seller, they could have been out of pocket by replacing, as they would not have the option to check your local phone book to see the receivers name in there.
May Karma get the receiver and AP dress down the Courier, no wonder sellers have parcels go missing. Marian
Replied by feelin-couture on 06-Jul-2011 10:50 (Ref 2302692) Report
Probably a wise idea to explain the differece between normal registered post and person to person as i am not familiar with many sellers taking up the person to person option.

Normal registered post means anyone at the address can sign for it so often on tracking you will see a name that isn't the person you addressed it to - eg/someone else at that address.  This can cause trouble if its a business address or share house.

Person to Person is extra but means only the person who its addressed to must sign for it.

If you have a problem with Aus Post get the operators name then demand the call be escalated to a supervisor. 
You can also make a report to the postal industry ombudsman and if its not resolved appropriately within the 10 working day charter AP can be liable for a $2000 fine.
Replied by remaynerecycled on 06-Jul-2011 11:25 (Ref 2302694) Report
I think the person at AP told you wrong. Maybe the compensation for lost items might have to be claimed by the person sending but anyone can put in a customer service complaint form to have them go looking for the parcel.

I remembered that I had one from last week that was never lodged so got it out to have a look. It has tick boxes for either s sender or addressee to fill out the details and the customer declaration at the bottom reads:

blah blah......I have read the conditions on the reverse of this sheet and as the sender/addressee I wish to assign any entitlement to the sender/addressee. And then a promise to let AP know if the item is deliverd to either of the two

the tick boxes cover lost items/missing contents/damanged items/express post service failure

If it happens again that you need to chase something up there as a buyer grab a copy of that form and read it out to them. I can't see anything on it to say a buyer can't claim so long as they know where and when it was sent and the dollar value they want if it isn't found.

There is another form to fill in after that one to get the money back so maybe that's the one only a seller can sign? I don't have a copy of that on hand.
Replied by bitemycrankshaft on 06-Jul-2011 12:25 (Ref 2302696) Report
I can't see anything on it to say a buyer can't claim
That's because anybody can claim - provided the sender has assigned them their rights... however, under normal circumstance (and without the sender's written waiver) only the sender can claim for a lost article.  This is quite clearly stipulated under section G6.2 of the General Post Guide (see screen shot below)... so there is no need to include the same information on the form... as it is considered to be common knowledge.





anyone can put in a customer service complaint form to have them go looking for the parcel 
AP will not commence any investigation relating to a lost article without proof of lodgement... this can be in the form of a lodgement receipt, or a bulk pack receipt (in the case of satchels as an example)... but they will not even consider action based solely on the addressee's word that an item has actually been posted... because generally the addressee is simply not privy to any of the lodgement/non-lodgement details.

Therefore, while anybody can physically lodge a form... there is really no point... because unless the relevant information is provided by the sender... the form will only ever be used to wipe twice and file in the Caroma filing system.


 
When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so
long at the closed door, we do not see the one which has opened for us.
Replied by pisces-oztion on 06-Jul-2011 13:22 (Ref 2302702) Report

From what I can see the seller does not need to put in a claim for a refund in this case as the parcel was retrieved from where it had been delivered, but Monty's point is that she was told the Seller would have had to make the claim for a refund.

Anybody can put in a Customer Service Complaint at any time for any reason, even if it does not relate to online selling and is nothing to do with the claim for a refund for a lost article.

The AP Courier broke the agreement to deliver a Registered Article with the extra Person to Person signature required.
Furthermore, he allowed the wrong person at the wrong address to claim it as his, which is Fraud by Deception and if it was me I would have reported him to the Police.

And no matter what any postal worker says, when a person pays to have something delivered by AP, Temando or any other courier service, they are legally responsible to deliver it.
Just as any other worker is responsible to carry out their duty of employment.
Replied by montynonuts on 06-Jul-2011 13:36 (Ref 2302704) Report
Good Afternoon Everyone

I rang the aust post ombudsman this morning to complain about my parcel going to the wrong person and wrong address after not only paying for registered post and the extra for person to person

After explaining it all to her I was told that this is fraud and was given a reference number and I had 10 days to lodge the complaint
but for me as the buyer to follow it up I would of had to get a waiver from the seller as bitemycrankshaft  said had we not received it

Then I rang aust post and told them what I thought of the whole mess including that we tracked our own parcel down

My point to them was it may of been something of great importance eg it could of been someones medication and worse it could of been someones ashes as I do know sometimes they  are couriered out

They also told me if I wanted to take this further and claim for compensation I would also have to get the sellers waiver
 
On a good note I am finally enjoying my item no thanks to the Aust Post courier
Replied by remaynerecycled on 06-Jul-2011 15:18 (Ref 2302712) Report
well as I said I have no idea what's on the form to claim the cash back as I don't have that here with me but a buyer can definitely fill out the customer service complaint form to go searching. And I've never had to produce a receipt when lodging the form but I have ticked the box that says I have a receipt so maybe that's the difference.

I've actually had two buyers go searching for their own parcel in the last week or so and both have found them. I forgot about the ADF one. So I still think it depends on who you get to help you at AP as to what you can do there.

Interesting, I thought that there was a box to tick on this form to say you had the receipt but I can't find anywhere that they even ask you for one so ? and the bottom part of it for the staff has bits where they can tick if they've paid you compensation, refunded fees, turned down the claim etc but nothing about whether they've seen a receipt again. So you must be able to be compensated with just the lodgement of this form, which is able to be filled out by buyer or seller and doesn't ask for a receipt?
Replied by myscentualaddictions on 06-Jul-2011 15:48 (Ref 2302720) Report
This is the reason I no longer use australia post for anything over 500g , I use Just Express Deliveries prices arent too much different to australia post and they pick up from the door or PO and deliver the same way. Im more than happy with their service. Well worth a look.
Replied by pisces-oztion on 06-Jul-2011 15:57 (Ref 2302725) Report

"well as I said I have no idea what's on the form to claim the cash back as I don't have that here with me but a buyer can definitely fill out the customer service complaint form to go searching."

Maybe the difference is that one is a Customer Service Complaint that asks the PO to have a look for a missing parcel which the buyer / recipient can do.

And one is a Claim for a lost parcel Refund which the seller / sender does because it is the seller / sender who receives the refund from AP.
Replied by remaynerecycled on 06-Jul-2011 17:35 (Ref 2302747) Report
well I thought if the parcel wasn't found then you had to go in and fill out another form for your refund but the bottom of this allows for a refund to be given on this form by the look of it.


it has little boxes where they can write refund amount given and date it's been given so ?

but anyway what monty was told is wrong. They said she could do nothing as a buyer and the seller had to chase up a claim when in fact she could fill out the lost parcel forms and find out whether the parcel could be found or not, at the very least. If the parcel was found to have disappeared then it might be a whole different ball game, but telling her she couldn't do anything and had to get the seller to do it all was actually wrong.

Go grab one of these forms, ring them back and tell them they were wrong.Will be most satisfying for you.

Oh and I've definitely lodged a form that sent them searching for parcels without producing the receipt. I had it so I knew the date and time, but on the form they only need an approximate time not the actual time to the minute that it was lodged. But no one asked me to show it to them so I took it back home with me unseen.

ooo hang about......so if that bit cranky posted is right, if a parcel is damaged or goods are broken the buyer has to go chase it up with  AP not the seller? Which makes at least part of the I can't be responsible for what AP does to a package TOS actually quite right? It's not the sellers repsonsibility unless AP claims poor packaging?
Replied by pisces-oztion on 06-Jul-2011 18:40 (Ref 2302769) Report

You seem to have misunderstood the whole post which is about how even a Registered and / or Person to Person delivered parcel is no guarantee that it will be received by the right person.

I read it as how she was told that she could not claim a refund for a lost parcel as the seller had to do that, "I had a registered parcel go missing yesterday and my phone call today to Australia Post Enquiries told me I could do nothing as the Seller is the one who has to chase up a claim with them"

Also as she found the parcel herself by using the tracking system there was no need to put in a form for anything. "The Aust Post tracking system worked perfectly as it gave us the name of the person who signed for it "
and
"They admitted it was there and gave it to my husband. "

Thirdly, the compensation the Ombudsman told her she may be eligible for is for the cost of the Registered Fee and the cost of the Person to Person fee she paid for which was not done.

And finally the people who signed for the parcel which was not addressed to them committed an offence and the AP courier broke all of the rules by delivering to the wrong person at the wrong address (even though it had the correct address on the parcel) and accepting a signature which was not the one on the Person to Person bit.

And on that note, I'm out of here.
Replied by pashmina on 06-Jul-2011 20:35 (Ref 2302791) Report
Glad to hear it got sorted and the people gave it back to you Monty
Replied by remaynerecycled on 06-Jul-2011 20:48 (Ref 2302797) Report
the ombudsman told her she could claim compensation?

I thought person to person was different to registered post though?  While this one was delivered to the wrong address and the person signing for it knew it wasn't theirs, had it been delivered to monty's address mister monty or anyone else at the house could have signed for it legally yes?
Replied by bitemycrankshaft on 06-Jul-2011 23:07 (Ref 2302837) Report
 


 
When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so
long at the closed door, we do not see the one which has opened for us.
Replied by remaynerecycled on 06-Jul-2011 23:12 (Ref 2302838) Report
so no one but the registerd person can sign for that parcel?

then what is feelin on about further back?

and why don't they ask for ID when you sign for it then? Anyone in the house could go yeah that's me and sign for it otherwise.
Replied by pisces-oztion on 06-Jul-2011 23:17 (Ref 2302840) Report

"I thought person to person was different to registered post though? "

It is and was as Monty stated "Even though I paid for registered post with person to person delivery "

"While this one was delivered to the wrong address and the person signing for it knew it wasn't theirs, had it been delivered to monty's address mister monty or anyone else at the house could have signed for it legally yes?"

No. Person to Person means the person named is the only one who can sign for it and it is not just Registered Post but an additional means of secure delivery with an additional fee.

I don't understand why this is so difficult to understand but maybe this link will help as it explains both Registered Post and Person to Person. If you want your questions answered again by somebody in authority may I suggest you ask AP themselves for further clarification.

auspost.com.au/personal/registered-post.html

Scroll down to this bit

Optional services (additional fees apply)
  • Delivery confirmation - a card is returned to you with the recipient's signature.
  • Person-to-person delivery* - your mail will be delivered to the addressee (only available within Australia).
  • Extra Cover up to $5,000 (only available within Australia).
and further down

Person-to-person article will be delivered to the addressee, except where:
(a) The addressee is a minor. The article may be delivered to a parent or guardian.
(b) The addressee has provided a prior written authority requesting articles be delivered to a nominated person.
(c) It is impractical for Australia Post to deliver to the addressee, this is at Australia Post's discretion.

And as the address was the correct one and as the addressee is not a minor or did not have prior written authority requesting the article to be delivered to the wrong person at the wrong address, and it was not impractical for the delivery to be made to the correct address, there was no reason for it to be at AP's discretion not to deliver it.

As for what the ombudsman told Monty she will have to tell you again but I thought she was pretty clear the first time.


Replied by marian-48 on 07-Jul-2011 07:40 (Ref 2302855) Report
Every parcel should at least be delivered to the correct address as stated on the parcel!
Let alone the extra services paid for, its a very poor show on behalf of AP.
No wonder parcels go missing at times. Marian
Replied by remaynerecycled on 07-Jul-2011 08:52 (Ref 2302861) Report
ah I missed the person to person bit on Monty's opening blurb

but I did read the ombudsman bit quite a few times and could only see that they advised her it was fraud and that she could do something about that, nothing about compensation except with the AP ones she spoke to.

I'm not entirely stupid but thank you for the condescending answer
Replied by pisces-oztion on 07-Jul-2011 09:21 (Ref 2302865) Report

You're welcome 

Replied by remaynerecycled on 07-Jul-2011 10:37 (Ref 2302873) Report
anyway it does make some things clearer

Monty could have chased that parcel up through Australia Post no matter what they said as a buyer can put in the form to report it lost. She can't put in the claim to get the cash back though without a seller waiver.

A buyer has to chase up the damaged items claim themselves unless poorly packaged although I'm sure most sellers would be happy to give input with copies of receipts and such.

And I'm apparently blind to the words person to person when written in bold green font
Replied by ejholden on 07-Jul-2011 12:43 (Ref 2302891) Report
I'm not entirely stupid
I trust you are not looking for an arguement on that point, remmers ....  
It all depends on the words you choose to use & comprehend, not the colour of the print.

According to my reading & comprehension course, a buyer can report an "undelivered article" and request assistance in trying to locate it. However, the amount of assistance you receive may be dependent on the A.P. person to speak to.

When it comes to "Lost" articles, only the Sender has authority to lodge a claim. They can, at that time, defer the compensation to the receiver.


In Monty's case, they would probably be thinking that as she has the article, what's she going on about?
However, if she lodges a delivery service complaint, (totally different to a missing/lost/undelivered article issue) they will kick the driver up the butt ....

Person > person is an optional extra (with additional fees) to the AP registered post program.
It is also available via Temando.

Which makes at least part of the I can't be responsible for what AP does to a package TOS actually quite right?
Nope .... Totally the opposite. A sender is the only one who can claim for a lost/missing article and the sender is the only one who is responsible for the packaging quality of an article. The receiver's only responsibility is to take the item & packaging to AP for inspection.

At least Temando has a fragile goods option ...... AP just has a drop 20kg on it option ....

All this just convinces me more that Temando is a better way to go.
Replied by ejholden on 07-Jul-2011 13:06 (Ref 2302896) Report
Addendum ...

I had occassion to contact AP yesterday re: a parcel being sent from Melbourne with tracking. The tracking shows it's receipt into the AP system last Friday & nothing since.
I requested AP to see if they could find where it is.

This is the response I just received.

Response Via Email (*** *) 07/07/2011 12.08 PM
Dear *************

I refer to your attached enquiry concerning Eparcel article number **************.

To enable further enquiries, it would be appreciated if you would ask the sender of the article to call Australia Post on 13 13 18, or to use our web mail enquiry service as you have in this instance, to commence an enquiry. We need important details from the sender concerning the lodgement of the article, its size and contents, addressee details, and other necessary information to enable enquiries to be carried out.

If you have any queries concerning this or any other postal matter, please do not hesitate to reply to this email.

Regards,
*** * | Digital & Contact Centres - eServices | Australia Post
Online Services Consultant

GPO Box 9911 In Your Capital City
P: 13 13 18 | W: www.auspost.com.au

Obviously, AP consider that it is all up to the sender, no input desired from the receiver.
NOTE: I have not requested a claim, I just made an "any idea where it is" enquiry ....
Replied by pisces-oztion on 07-Jul-2011 13:27 (Ref 2302899) Report

Thank you Ejholden    for reiterating and proving what I have been saying for a very long time, years even.

I would lend you this     but I'm sure you have one of your own on standby. 


Replied by remaynerecycled on 07-Jul-2011 16:29 (Ref 2302950) Report
I'm not sure how a seller could help with damaged goods. If they've packed them properly then according to what Cranky has copied from the AP site the buyer has to take the goods to the post office, and a buyer gets the compensation if proved to be the fault of AP with damage. So what exactly can a seller do about the damage if they've packaged it properly?

I had a registered parcel go missing yesterday and my phone call today to Australia Post Enquiries told me I could do nothing as the Seller is the one who has to chase up a claim with them

that's the information I was working from. It reads to me that Monty has called to try to find the parcel, not get compensation. AP has said that she can't chase up a claim. A claim being refund of cash if the parcel isn't found yes? But she can put in a form to send them looking for that parcel on her behalf which they haven't told her.

I have the form sitting here and if I filled that out and went to an AP counter  and they advised me that I couldn't ask where the parcel was I'd be pointing out to them that their form  says I can.  I also wasn't asked if I was the sender or the addressee when handed the form at the counter.

I'm not reading the what i want or picking out certain words. I'm reading  boxes on the form giving the addressee the option to fill out the form to find it. There is nothing on that form that says an addressee cannot fill it out and it clearly gives the option for them to do so.

There is very fine print in light green on the back of the form if someone wants to grab one and read it themselves that might have something on it that says the front bit is all wrong but I've read it the best I can and I can't find it.

A few of you seem unable to comprehend: it's a form the post office gives you to report lost or damaged items not something I've just written up myself and I'm sitting here with the form so not going by memory or what I think it should say.

A buyer cannot get compensation according to what Cranky has copied off their site but as Monty was trying to find her parcel rather than get compensation for it AP advised her wrongly over the phone. She could instigate the search for it. If the search failed to find the parcel then she would have to get a seller to lodge a waiver or chase it up for her.
Replied by pisces-oztion on 07-Jul-2011 16:46 (Ref 2302955) Report

"It reads to me that Monty has called to try to find the parcel, not get compensation. AP has said that she can't chase up a claim. A claim being refund of cash if the parcel isn't found yes? But she can put in a form to send them looking for that parcel on her behalf which they haven't told her."

No. She rang to make a complaint about them delivering to the wrong person at the wrong address. Monty said they told her the Seller was the one to make a claim. Please note the word claim.
Monty was not making a claim as the parcel was not missing but as it said on the Tracking, it was delivered to the wrong address.

"A few of you seem unable to comprehend: it's a form the post office gives you to report lost or damaged items"

But she was not reporting a lost or damaged item as her husband had already got the parcel from the fraudsters.

As she has the parcel there is no need for a claim to be made.

I repeat, I think you will find the ombudsman told her the compensation was for the Registered Post and Person to Person fees she paid.
Replied by montynonuts on 07-Jul-2011 17:05 (Ref 2302962) Report
Good Afternoon remaynerecycled

I do not mean to sound rude but you seem to have a problem comprehending what I am saying
I will try to make it clear and simple for you

1.My parcel whilst I was tracking was delivered to the wrong address and wrong person who signed for it

2.The following morning I rang Aust Post to complain about it going to the wrong address and ask about my parcel and was told by them I could not make a claim or follow it up as I was not the sender

3.Then by chance my husband looked in the phone book and found the name of the people who had signed for the parcel and he went to the street behind us and got our parcel off them

4.I then rang the ombudsman to lodge my complaint and was told I could receive compensation for the registered and person to person as I had my parcel I also told the ombudsman what Aust Post had said to me and I was told that that was the correct procedure Aust Post had given me had we not located the parcel

5. I then rang Aust Post back and told them I had lodged a complaint to the ombudsman about the parcel going to the wrong address
Now Aust Post says the complaint about the parcel going to the wrong address has also be made by the sender not me

Hopefully this is clear now even though it is in green font
A Claim is not just looking for a parcel

Edit: As EJholden said the seller is responsible for making a claim whether it is registered or not both Aust Post and the Aust Post Ombudsman confirmed this
Replied by remaynerecycled on 07-Jul-2011 18:21 (Ref 2302969) Report
yes but that's not what you said up until now and I'm not able to read minds or between the lines so had no idea that was what you meant except for being told by someone else that's what you said when I read what you said and it's clearly not there.

you said a parcel went missing and you phoned AP who said you could do nothing about it as the buyer. This is untrue. You could have gone and lodged a form to find that parcel. If it was not found then the seller would have to step in.

you also didn't say that the ombudsman had had said you could claim back the reg parcel cost.

A claim is actually asking them for a refund for whatever reason. Searching for the parcel is either an enquiry or a complaint that the buyer has not received their parcel which a buyer can do..

To get your money back in compensation you have to put in a claim. A claim is asking for something. This is the part a seller must do.

Anyway this is all rather pointless as it always becomes in these arguments I've found. I'd advise anyone reading this to not rely on who says what to who, what isn't said but is implied or meant to be said but forgotten and how anyone wants to interpret anything to suit themselves but actually go to your post office and get a claim form and see for themselves that they can actually fill it out as a buyer and there is nothing on that form that says they can't and in fact the form is set up so that they can.

Then when AP phones you to tell you that they cannot find your parcel ask them what the next step is that you have to take.
Replied by remaynerecycled on 07-Jul-2011 18:21 (Ref 2302970) Report
my bad

system said it didnt post as it timed out but apparently it did post

Replied by pisces-oztion on 07-Jul-2011 19:20 (Ref 2302980) Report

"yes but that's not what you said up until now " Edited and coloured to show where you said she lied.

It is what she said and repeated several times so don't call her a liar because you didn't understand it and just wanted to argue the point over your constant claim that the seller is not responsible for making a claim for a lost or damaged parcel.

All of this is absolutely ridiculous when all she wanted to do was show that even if a parcel is Registered and even if extra is paid for Person to Person delivery, the parcel can still be delivered to the wrong address.

Even if the form does say a buyer can ask for a lost parcel to be looked for without them making a claim, it has nothing to do with Monty's case of her parcel going to the wrong address, which WAS NOT LOST AS THE TRACKING SHOWED IT HAD BEEN DELIVERED TO THE WRONG PERSON.

You can continue harping on the form and what it says to your heart's content, it still won't change the fact that it has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with a parcel that was not lost or damaged but was delivered to the wrong address and being signed for by the wrong people, and which the ombudsman told Monty she could be compensated for.

Lost Meaning.
Past tense and past participle of lose.
adj.
1. Unable to find one's way: a lost child.
2.
a. No longer in the possession, care, or control of someone or something: a lost pen
b. No longer in existence; vanished or spent: lost youth.
c. No longer known or practiced: a lost art.
d. Beyond reach, communication, or influence:

None of which apply as Monty knew where the parcel was and her husband retrieved it.

A more honest person than Monty would be hard to find and I know for a fact that you implying she is lying about what she said will cause her great distress. I just hope she doesn't come back to read what you wrote.

And all I did was try to explain exactly the same thing to you, and that takes me out of here. Unbelievable!
Replied by remaynerecycled on 07-Jul-2011 21:05 (Ref 2302991) Report
oh good grief talk about see what you want to see

it is not what she said in the first line she wrote where she said that she lost her parcel and rang ap who told her..........

I didn't call or imply she was a liar. You're choosing to see it that way. I said it's not what she wrote because oh I don't don't know........it's not what she wrote?

The order of what happened as I understood it going from the opening post was parcel is missing, ring AP who say she can't make a claim. Trace parcel through tracking. Ring ombudsman. ring AP again.

I'm sorry Monty if I misunderstood the order of what happened but that is how it's written and I can't even see anything else in that opening statement to say that you found the parcel yesterday or that anything else happened yesterday except that the parcel went missing.

I also read and re-read the ombudsman post futher down and could not for the life of me see where you said the ombudsman said you could claim the reg post fees back.

I'll happily admit to not seeing the person to person bit in your post but the rest of it is exactly how I read it.

Just once i'd like to have a freaking conversation in this place that doesn't end up with someone in hysterics over nothing

ahhh I see where I'm meant to have called her a liar. "you said a parcel went missing and you phoned AP who said you could do nothing about it as the buyer. This is untrue. You could have gone and lodged a form to find that parcel. If it was not found then the seller would have to step in."

what I meant is that what AP told Monty is untrue. As that was what I'd been saying all the way through I thought that would stand out like the proverbial dogs parts. My bad for thinking people might have actually read what I was writing.
Replied by ejholden on 07-Jul-2011 21:38 (Ref 2302995) Report
 remmers ....
You seem to have a train of thought that keeps jumping the switch and running around the same loop ......

you said a parcel went missing and you phoned AP who said you could do nothing about it as the buyer. This is untrue.

Unfortunately, it is true.
Sure, we may have had someone do us a favour in the past; maybe a new person did something they shouldn't have; but the protocol is that only the seller can institute an enquiry.

This is what AP told Monty, this is what the Ombudsman told Monty, this is what Biteme posted in her pdf, this is what I posted in the email from AP.
This is what I have also been told in the past.

I'm sorry, but it is true .....
Replied by dontcallmebaby on 07-Jul-2011 21:39 (Ref 2302996) Report
I read it, understood what you meant, didn't read as you calling anyone a liar.


All makes for interesting reading really.
Not sure what difference it would make living in the same address for 35 years. Have had the same driver almost always deliver things here for Ap and he stuffed up on Monday with a person to person delivery. I had 1 and nextdoor had 1. Didn't ask me for ID and as i was expecting 2 P2p parcels, i accepted both of the ones he gave me. Opened 1 yep what i waiting for, opened the other and thought WTH? Was for nextdoor, i quickly ran in & explained what happened and they were cool about it all, but it could have been a big stuff up if someone else had gotten these items as the were security passes and what not.
Replied by ejholden on 07-Jul-2011 21:44 (Ref 2302997) Report
security passes and what not.

Ouch ..... not good in this day & age .....
Still, if your going to make a stuff up, you may as well make it good one .....
Replied by dontcallmebaby on 07-Jul-2011 22:01 (Ref 2303002) Report
Yep, That's what i thought. Still waiting on my other P2P parcel, so I'm hoping he didn't stuff that one up and deliver it to God knows who lol.
Replied by remaynerecycled on 08-Jul-2011 01:21 (Ref 2303019) Report
so if a buyer or addressee cannot instigate an enquiry why do they give them a form to fill out that says they can?

Incidentally anyone in this discussion has had ample time since it started to pick up a form from the post office. All you have to do is go in and say you need a form for a lost parcel.

And no one has come in here and said I'm wrong on what the form says. Please someone go get the damn form from an AP counter and read it and tell me whether a buyer can or cannot fitll out and lodge that form.

Monty was not told that she could not make an enquiry, going by what she has written. She was told that she could not make a claim. As her wording was that she lost a parcel then phoned AP, and I assumed by the order of what she had posted that she did that BEFORE she found the parcel, then the AP person should have advised her to fill out the form at her local PO to find the parcel. Had I known that she had phoned after finding the parcel herself and had been discussing compensation for the reg post fees then I would have understood why the AP worker said she couldn't make a claim.

The form that you lodge to FIND a parcel is a customer complaint form which covers many things. The form that you lodge for compensation (CLAIM) for a lost parcel or failure of express post or reg post is a different form. It is lodged after AP has contacted you to say they failed to find the parcel or are found to have not kept to the terms of the postage you paid for. A seller or a buyer can make an enquiry. A seller must make the claim.

I cannot be the only person to have to lodge two separate forms if a parcel goes missing and isn't found.
Replied by remaynerecycled on 08-Jul-2011 01:52 (Ref 2303020) Report
actually I've thought about this and it's really not worth the hassle

obviously, as you say, Australia Post has produced a form for customers that is clearly a lie hoping that they will not get caught out.
Replied by ejholden on 08-Jul-2011 02:17 (Ref 2303022) Report
Two forms ?  Wow .... You're privileged !

I have only ever been given the one Customer Service Complaint  form or PM26, which according to the copy I have here hasn't been updated since Apr'02 ......
Replied by bitemycrankshaft on 08-Jul-2011 08:43 (Ref 2303041) Report
A seller or a buyer can make an enquiry.

As was made quite clear to you 2 days ago... only an enquiry made by the sender will be followed up by AP... if the enquiry is made by the addressee, the result will be a standard response stating that the sender needs to make the enquiry.

As was pointed out 2 days ago (and further supported yesterday by the email response posted by the old holden)... among other reasons, this is because under normal circumstances the addressee does not have access to lodgement details... and therefore does not know if the article was actually ever posted.  AP will not waste any time or resources looking for an article which has quite possibly never even entered their network.  Remember that the oldest lie in the book is "It's in the mail".

I really don't understand why this is such a difficult concept to grasp. 


 
When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so
long at the closed door, we do not see the one which has opened for us.
Replied by pisces-oztion on 08-Jul-2011 09:10 (Ref 2303050) Report

OK, for anybody else not reading past Monty's first line therefore not getting the full story in the Opening Post. I got the tracking number from Monty and went to AP Tracking and got this bit below.
The tracking number and the name of the guilty person have been removed.

As can be seen at no time was her parcel 'lost'. My understanding of her posts are that she contacted AP because her parcel was missing from delivery. As can be seen below it was still Scheduled for Delivery and Onboard with the Driver and that's when she was told that the Sender had to make a claim.
As she was not making a claim as the parcel was not lost Monty went back to the Tracking then saw that the parcel had been delivered by then to the wrong person and that's when her husband looked up their name in the phone book and went around to get their parcel which had been delivered to the wrong address.
That's when she made a complaint to the ombudsman and was again told that it had to be done by the seller.
Nothing to do with any forms as she was not making an enquiry or a claim for a lost parcel as it was not lost.

Also, her edit about living there for 35 years was probably in reply to Tvshowsondvd to show her problem was nothing to do with mail redirection.


Tracking ID:
Product/Service: eParcel
Tracking ID: Status: Delivered
Tracking details
Date/Time    Activity    Location
05/07/11 14:40    Please call 13 13 18 for more information    SOUTHERN CALL CENTRE - OPERATI
04/07/11 16:55    Delivered X XXXX    NEWCASTLE PARCEL CENTRE
04/07/11 06:15    Onboard with driver    NEWCASTLE PARCEL CENTRE
04/07/11 01:37    Scheduled for delivery today    NEWCASTLE PARCEL CENTRE
02/07/11 02:32    Accepted at Sortation Facility    SYDNEY PARCEL FACILITY OPNS
01/07/11 18:00    Manifest accepted    SYDNEY PARCELS BULK LODGEMENT
01/07/11 11:53    Manifest received    SYDNEY PARCELS BULK LODGEMENT
Replied by montynonuts on 08-Jul-2011 09:27 (Ref 2303055) Report
Good Morning  pisces-oztion
That is not quite right
It was the next day that we rang Aust Post and asked why did my parcel got delivered to the wrong address and I might add the street it was delivered to did not even sound like my street name
Replied by pisces-oztion on 08-Jul-2011 09:32 (Ref 2303056) Report

Oops, sorry 

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